[ Home ]

[ Forums ]

[ Links ]

Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.

Kindly note that you need to register and/or be logged in to post messages and replies. This will only take a moment, so please do so today. This step has been made necessary to prevent automated spam message posting. Self registration has been disabled, please send an e-mail to mg@maltagardening.com with your desired username/password, and email address, and your account will be set up promptly. September 22, 2018, 17:20:23 PM
[ Home :: Help :: Search :: Login :: Register ]

+  Malta Gardening.com
|-+  Malta Gardening Forums
| |-+  Pests, Diseases and Weeds
| | |-+  Garni
« previous next »
Pages: [1] 2 Print
Author Topic: Garni  (Read 6978 times)
Jetset
Tamarisk
***
Posts: 58



View Profile
Garni
« on: December 06, 2007, 16:34:40 PM »

Does anyone have a solution for eliminating Garni?  Don't know the english word but they are like wild mini lilies that don't flower.

Year by year they are gaining ground on me and I am now facing an uncontrolable invasion of them.  When plucked they are back the same size in very few days. I have tried plucking the same one time and time again over winter, but absolutely no difference.

I have dug up patches and removed all the bulbs (basal), and once again, within weeks the area is full again.

I noticed that the bulb has attcahed four or five very fine white roots, which are easily detached when extracting the bulb.  I thus deduced that unless the bulb is taken out complete with these five strands, each one will produce a new garna.

I made an experiment on one meter square of soil.  I spent all morning on it and practically sifted all the soil down to about 10 inches deep.  Each bulb was carefully removed and great attention was paid to remove each of these pesky 'hairs'.  I was sure that had done it.

How wrong I was!  Within less than a month, there are many more garni in that one meter than when I started.

I went around garden centres seeking a solution and two said there is no solution to the garni problem.  A third (Agri Co-op) gave me GLYS (Roundup?) to try and sounded quite confident.

Yet 4 days later no sign of withering.

Does anyone have any experience with this weed?
Logged
MG
Administrator
Araucaria
*****
Posts: 466



View Profile WWW
Re: Garni
« Reply #1 on: December 06, 2007, 17:45:27 PM »

"I went around garden centres seeking a solution and two said there is no solution to the garni problem. "

Hmmm, you may as well not ask for any form of advice from them again.

"A third (Agri Co-op) gave me GLYS (Roundup?) to try and sounded quite confident."

Exactly. Roundup will work on them, and it will also work on Oxalis (ingliza) and other perennials.

Roundup is a systemic weedkiller (non-selective - will kill anything) which means that it will be absorbed and transported throughout the plant (including the troublesome tubers of garni) and kill it completely.

It may take a couple of weeks for the effects to show, it is very important that you do NOT remove any leaves from treated plants at least for 5 days, as otherwise you may be interfering with the absorbtion and the effectiveness. Letting the plant die slowly without any interference is best.

There is more info about using glyphosate here: http://www.maltagardening.com/gardentalk/index.php?topic=4.0 which may be Oxalis specific in parts, but basically the important thing is to use this on an actively growing plant, the healthier the weed is, the surer is the kill.

So let them grow, do not remove any leaves, and let them have it when they are at their best.

Sometimes another application in a different season is required if the first does not seem to be working well. This because with some tuberous/bulbed plants the greatest effectiveness is often to be had when the plants are preparing to go dormant and are transferring energy reserves from the leaves to the tubers, and this period would be best for application as the glyphosate would similarly be more effectively transported downwards.

Garni: http://es.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arisarum_vulgare or the large one:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arum_italicum

MG
« Last Edit: December 06, 2007, 17:56:20 PM by MG » Logged

Jetset
Tamarisk
***
Posts: 58



View Profile
Re: Garni
« Reply #2 on: December 10, 2007, 20:37:37 PM »

Thanks for your comments.

It has been over a week now since I sprayed, and no sign yet of any withering. I hope that the recent rains did not dilute the effect.  I sprayed nettles (hurrieq) as well, and round-up surely works on them, so I am still confident of success!

In certain areas, where I had plants that I want to survive, I used a paint brush and dabbed the weed killer on the garni leaf.  I am hoping that this will be as successful as the fine spray.

Hopefully will get some results next week!

Quote
Letting the plant die slowly without any interference is best.

In the meantime however, will the seeds (of nettles for example) germinate?
« Last Edit: December 10, 2007, 20:43:01 PM by Jetset » Logged
MG
Administrator
Araucaria
*****
Posts: 466



View Profile WWW
Re: Garni
« Reply #3 on: December 10, 2007, 23:21:28 PM »

Allow more time for the effects to be visible. Glyphosate works in a rather unique way, it does not, strictly speaking, kill the plant - it stops it from growing, both above and below ground. The effect is the same, however.

It is normally absorbed within a few hours and is probably rain-proof after around 8 hours, though of course it takes longer than that to translocate throughout the plant, which is why no treated leaves should be removed.

You did well to paint on weedkiller where the garni were growing in close proximity of desirable plants, some plants are spectacularly sensitive to glyphosate, even the slightest of overspray may kill these, see the Oxalis thread for an example of a common ground cover plant that may be counted amongst these.

If you see no effect after 2 weeks, it may not be the ideal time to apply. Assuming that you used an adequate dosage of course, use the highest recommended for these types of plants.

Nettles should show effects more rapidly and since these are annuals if you don't have a major problem you may as well rip them out of the ground.

Glyphosate is effective on most weeds, but some are tougher and require an extra application, some are very particular about the timing of the application, but with persistence you will prevail.

MG
Logged

Jetset
Tamarisk
***
Posts: 58



View Profile
Re: Garni
« Reply #4 on: December 24, 2007, 18:51:22 PM »

Just an update on my progress (or lack of it!) in my battle of the garni.

I'm afraid that round 1 goes to the garni!

It has now been over 3 weeks since I first sprayed roundup on the invading garni that have multipied profusely this year.

Though round up has been effective on the thissles and other weeds, only a handful of the hundreds of garni have shown any signs of defeat and turned brown.  I had applied roundup another two times in the interim also, many of them 'hand-painted' to protect the surrounding foliage.

This week I got a tip to add some liquid soap to help the poison stick to the slippery surface of the garni.  It sounds sensible so I spent all morning once again spraying and painting and it seemed to work in that the application stayed put on the leaf for a while.  It didn't rain all day either, which should also help hopefully.

Fingers frossed for some good results.  I'll keep you posted, but I'll be away from the island most of January.

Best wishes for Christmas and the New Year.

Logged
MG
Administrator
Araucaria
*****
Posts: 466



View Profile WWW
Re: Garni
« Reply #5 on: December 26, 2007, 00:13:50 AM »

Very likely reason for lack of success:

The plant is currently NOT translocating nutrients to the rhizome. It would normally do this before entering dormancy, when the rhizomes are taking away nutrients from the dying leaves and storing them. This would be in late spring, before the plant dies down naturally.

To compound the matter, the cold weather makes the plant grow more slowly and since glyphosate works on GROWING tips then it would not be effective when the growth is very slow or stopped.

However notwithstanding, you may still have some success during other periods as there is always some form of transfer.

Have you used the correct dosage? Use the maximum for this plant.

Re liquid soap, that is totally un-necessary, Roundup already contains high-tech surfactants (wetting agents) and also agents that enable the glyphosate to be absorbed by the leaves, as the aforegoing are the key to it's success.

Glyphosate alone would be useless as it would very simply not be absorbed by the leaves.

I would not add anything in case it interferes with the process.

MG

Logged

Jetset
Tamarisk
***
Posts: 58



View Profile
Re: Garni
« Reply #6 on: April 03, 2008, 18:09:49 PM »

Here is an update about my garni problem:

Victory at last! After some 5/6 attempts with round-up since last November, I have finally defeated the last resiliant Garni.  So it is certainly as you say; it needs to be applied at this time of the year (Feb/March) when the weed is
Quote
translocating nutrients to the rhizome
.

They are ceratainly a resiliant crop (to weed killer).  Whilst other weeds die off quasi immedeatly, very few garni were withering (though some did = ironic) when I applied roundup last autumn, when they first appeared and later throughout winter.  Only the last application brought measured success, and not even totally!  Lets hope it has done the trick, and that next season i do not get another outbreak!

Thanks for the tips.
Logged
MG
Administrator
Araucaria
*****
Posts: 466



View Profile WWW
Re: Garni
« Reply #7 on: April 03, 2008, 20:47:11 PM »

Good news indeed!

MG
Logged

Jetset
Tamarisk
***
Posts: 58



View Profile
Re: Garni
« Reply #8 on: November 19, 2008, 18:08:51 PM »

New season, same problem unfortunately.  The new shoots are generally in the same areas, so I can only assume that last spring, the insecticide only killed the stem but not the root/bulb.

Once again this year I have given them alot of attention, pulling up each and every bulb, and carefully extracting it intact with the 5 to 8 delicate strands/roots that come out of the bulb.  I have deduced that if any of the stands are left in the soil, each one will produce a new shoot.

What I cannot understand is how, after all this constant attention, (this is the third winter I have not given them time to take hold), I am still getting new shoots in the same problem areas, and even worse, in completely new areas also.
Logged
Avocado
Cypress Tree
****
Posts: 153



View Profile
Re: Garni
« Reply #9 on: November 19, 2008, 21:13:04 PM »

This is indeed a full blown epic battle against a plant which is part of the island's flora. I find that these plants are so adapted to the humid conditions which prevail in winter, especially in the shade that they can even compete with Oxalis and that's saying something!!!
 
I think that you can only control their number and that in fact, you have done extremely well. Ultimate victory is next to impossible akin to halting partisan activity in conquered countries in war time!

Perhaps even a small fragment of root or stem for that matter can develop into a new plant, so one can make the matter worse when you pull them up! One might eventually reduce their food reserves or vigour but it would need a concerted effort to eventually eliminate them. There is the possibility of seeds too as an alternative fail safe method of propagation and perhaps the seeds have long periods of dormancy or are dispersed very quickly and easily throughout the soil by insects etc.

Good Luck and never say die! Wink
Logged
MG
Administrator
Araucaria
*****
Posts: 466



View Profile WWW
Re: Garni
« Reply #10 on: November 20, 2008, 10:43:11 AM »

True, as Avocado is saying, you may have seeds in the soil. Persistence is key. If I were to try digging them up, I'd only do this a week after having sprayed them - so any bits that are left behind would hopefully have been poisoned.

I have eliminated Garni from the most awkward of places by using Glyphosate. I make sure that the max dosage is used, and use a paintbrush (with gloves) to paint the leaves individually top and bottom, thus ensuring good absorbtion but more importantly avoiding overspray onto the stuff you don't want to kill.

MG
Logged

Jetset
Tamarisk
***
Posts: 58



View Profile
Re: Garni
« Reply #11 on: November 21, 2008, 20:06:29 PM »

Thanks for your replies.

From your replies I've learned two things:

Seeds.  Do these Garni flower?  I haven't given them the chance to flower the last 3 years, so in case the new shoots must be seeds which have a long dormancy.

When I have previously applied Glyphosate, I have only painted it on the top of the leaf.  Next time I will paint the bottom too.  However i think I shall only bother to apply it in spring, as the only measured success previously was in this season.

For the moment, I am 'dead heading' them repetetively, in the hope that it will harm/tire the bulb in some way!

The battle continues......

Logged
Avocado
Cypress Tree
****
Posts: 153



View Profile
Re: Garni
« Reply #12 on: November 21, 2008, 21:23:23 PM »

Yes they certainly do flower.

I believe the English name for Garni is Friar's cowl. The flower is long and tubular curving anteriorally to expose a long yellowish stigma. It is not spectacular in that it is a brown flower. It is about7cm in length and 1cm in diameter. Its shape is unique. As a boy I likened it to a cobra's head.

I've never seen their seeds because I usually don't let them get to that stage!

I think your sheer determination is commendable - if at first you don't succeed try and try again... and I agree you may eventually wear their rhizomatous food stores away.

Finally, I think it is probably just as important, if not more important to apply the weed killer on underside of the leaf as the stomata (or openings for air exchange) are there and the noxious chemical will penetrate to greater effect!

I look forward to ultimate victory!  Grin
Logged
Avocado
Cypress Tree
****
Posts: 153



View Profile
Re: Garni
« Reply #13 on: November 21, 2008, 21:28:47 PM »

Incidentally, if you do an image search in google for Friar's Cowl, there are several pictures of plant and flower. Smiley
Logged
Jetset
Tamarisk
***
Posts: 58



View Profile
Re: Garni
« Reply #14 on: November 22, 2008, 19:30:15 PM »

Oh THAT is the seed! Of course!  I was thinking of a flower! Roll Eyes

Yes, I get those (and they too get the chop!) but they are surpisingly rare.  Only get a few of them, compared to the hundreds of garni.  Which, seeing how easily Garni greminate and proliferate, is quite surprising!

From what I see in my garden they are 'different/distinct' from the normal garni, in that they grow straight into this format, whilst the others are born a leaf and remain so their whole life. Perhaps Garni have gender, and these are the females!!
Logged
Pages: [1] 2 Print 
« previous next »
Jump to:  


Login with username, password and session length

Powered by MySQL Powered by PHP Powered by SMF 1.1.11 | SMF © 2006-2009, Simple Machines LLC
SMF Theme © Gaia
Valid XHTML 1.0! Valid CSS!